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Fansubbing/Scanlating, Is It Bad?

WhenSpamAttacks writes: On August 1st, OneManga.com removed its viewable content due to mounting pressur from publishers. With anything in the same vein as OneManga, they constantly run the risk of being shut down. For many it’s a matter of when not if. It is a direct violation of copyright laws, but it doesn’t make it suck any less. Now its not as if OneManga was the only site online with viewable content of translated manga, for the most part places like OneManga are just a place for scanlation groups to upload their work for other people to enjoy. They weren’t the most comprehensive, but they did have an extensive collection, when a title was licensed into English they were removed, with a scant few notable exceptions. It raises the question, a constant familiar for those of us into anime and manga, is fansubbing/scanlating a bad thing?"

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SynGamer2285d ago

Seriously, there are some great shows I'd love to have officially subtitles/dubbed so that I can support the original creators...Japan (and Asia in general) needs to get on this and release a lot of these Kdrama's online or via DVD!

Reibooi2285d ago

Are they bad? Yes... very bad...

Sure people will defend them and say it's ok for shows or manga that haven't been released in the US but the problem is that that stuff isn't the only stuff being fan subbed and scanlated. Plenty of groups do the stuff that has been out in the US forever and still don't care.

Then there is the issue of impacting sales before the show gets here. Sure someone may say that show isn't out in the US yet so we will fan sub it. But then when it comes out even if the fan subbers take it off their site it's still around it's still on the web on megaupload or the countless aggregates and it's already done the damage. Why would anyone buy it if they have already seen it for free in what is becoming higher and higher quality(Blu-ray level in some cases).

The days of fan subs and scanlations being a way to grow a fan base are gone. The fan base may grow but it means nothing if all those fans are leeches who don't add money back into the system which is what happens when people watch or read the fan subs and translations.

Sprud2285d ago

The US isn't the entire world. Where I live no anime/manga ever gets licensed. The only way to get it is from fansubbers. Besides, even in the US not even 1% of all anime/manga gets released.

Reibooi2285d ago

OK lets break that down shall we..

The US isn't the entire world. Fact this is correct.

Where you live you can't get licensed manga or anime ever. False no matter where you live you can import anime from sites like Amazon or Rightstuf and often not for very much money. There are only a few places this is not possible because of censorship laws and seeing as you are on this site talking about it I don't think that is a issue.

Just because a Manga or anime is not released in your part of the world doesn't mean you are entitled to it. The people who work their butts off to create this stuff deserves compensation and downloading it with the weak excuse of it doesn't come out here where I live is BS. It's easy and cheap to get anime and manga shipped from Right stuf and amazon yet people still complain.

The creators don't make this stuff for free. Just because you want to see it doesn't mean you are entitled to it. Not without paying for it and there is always a way if you look for it.

Also the less then 1% argument is total BS. The only way this is valid is if you consider the ENTIRE library of all anime ever made. As for a season by season release a good 75% of the shows are either licensed outright or streamed via Crunchyroll, FUnimation or the Anime Network.

It doesn't matter where you live you can always do something to support the artist or people behind a show or manga. But people make as many excuses as possible to get out of that because they feel entitled and think they should be able to read and watch whatever they want totally free despite the fact that there are people behind the scenes trying to make a living.

SynGamer2284d ago

@ Reibooi

"Just because a Manga or anime is not released in your part of the world doesn't mean you are entitled to it. The people who work their butts off to create this stuff deserves compensation and downloading it with the weak excuse of it doesn't come out here where I live is BS. It's easy and cheap to get anime and manga shipped from Right stuf and amazon yet people still complain."

You contradicted yourself. If something isn't released in our part of the world, how can we buy it from Right Stuf? If it WAS available where I lived, I would gladly buy it, as I do with anything else. But the fact is that anything not licensed ISN'T available where I live and therefore my ONLY way to watch/read it is to rely on fansubs. This is assuming that things are region-coded AND/OR the item(s) I want are only in Japanese.

Reibooi2284d ago (Edited 2284d ago )

And as I said you are wrong assuming you can't buy it from Right Stuf. You speak English yes? I see you are typing in it. Right Stuf ships international as does Amazon so as I said assuming you don't live in a area with censorship laws you can easily IMPORT IT WITH RIGHT STUF. And guess where that money goes BACK TO THE CREATORS!!!

This is what I am talking about. People make up excuses instead of looking for solutions. I place one right in front of you and you either deny or ignore it.

It's very easily to gain access to anime legally regardless of where you are in the word as the amount of places selling things international is quite large. Assuming one speaks English and doesn't live in a area with censorship laws they can easily import from a site like Right Stuf or Amazon.com and the cost isn't very high at all. Which I can see I am repeating myself because people ignore facts and look for a excuse to download things instead of supporting those who create these incredible properties.

SynGamer2284d ago

You clearly AREN'T paying attention. The problem is if the SOURCE material hasn't been translated, and therefore DOESN'T exist in my language, how can I possible import it? I'm not going to import something that is only in Japanese when I can't read/watch that language. I've already stated I have no problem importing, buying if it's in my language and/or officially subtitled.

Reibooi2284d ago (Edited 2284d ago )

...

If the property you wish to see or read is not in your language YOU ARE NOT ENTITLED TO IT!!! it's as simple as that.

Simple and elegant solution to this problem is one a good friend of mine in teh anime industry came up with.

If you want to see or read something that you cannot get and you cannot wait until it is legally available you simple import the original Japanese and go ahead and read or watch your fan translation. Why? Well even if you are still doing something illegal in watching or reading the translation you have at the very least put money into the system and supported the creator and that is something is that quite easy to do and understand.

SynGamer2284d ago (Edited 2284d ago )

Why would I buy it though when it's not actually something that will benefit me? I want something dubbed/subbed (officially). If I buy the original Japanese, it's then useless if/when they release the English version. I see no reason why I should have to double-dip when the Japanese don't.

To touch on another topic; in this day and age, there's no reason why these companies can't hire 1 (one!) translator and have them subtitle a show and have it air online (there's plenty of other sites that could host as well). Or they could sell it. I'd gladly buy an officially subtitled DVD over free fansubs. The point is, if we pay the companies now for doing nothing (for us English consumers), then they aren't going to change their ways. Honestly, only fools or people with too much money to waste would buy the Japanese language-only DVD and then watch fansubs.

It's all about pleasing the consumer, not padding the wallets of companies who aren't doing anything for me. I'm not saying I'm entitled to anything, I'm simply saying I'm going to put my money towards something that will actually benefit me, aka, officially subbed/dubbed DVDs.

Reibooi2284d ago

Honestly seeing as how you don't work in the anime industry(and trust me I have quite a few friends in the industry on the US side)

It is not nearly as cheap and easy as you think it is to release something sub and quickly.

Firstly your idea of simply hiring 1 person to sub something is nearly impossible for MANY reasons. On the Japanese side of things there are very few fluent English speakers that work in the anime and manga Industry and as such their services in the realm of translating are in quite high demand and on top of that the shows are not a single episode so this one person would be tied to that show for a extended period of time and seeing as there are limited English translators in the Japanesee anime industry that is a bad thing as there are other show that need a translator as well.

On the US side of thing's it's not as simple as hire a single person and have them translate and sub. The companies in the US need to BUY the license rights before they can do anything. Without those rights(which are very expensive by the way) They can not dub it, sub it, stream it, make dvds or anything. The cost of the LICENSE itself is the main issue with anime coming out in the US.

To many people don't put their support into the industry. If someone watches fan subs instead of the legit product it hurts the companies and if they cannot make back their money they obviously cannot release more content. Many fan sub supporters use the excuse of "but this show isn't available legally so I watch the fan subs" When the fact is there is more often then not already a legal way to watch it.

Need a example? Ok then. This anime season Funimation has had legal streams for very popular shows such as Kuroshitsuji II and Seikerei season 2(and many others as well) and yet that didn't stop fan subbers and people alike from watching them illegally. That's the exact problem I speak of. You could go to ANY anime Con or forum and ask people who were keeping up and watching those 2 shows mentioned above where they were watching them and a very small percent would actually say Funimation.com with the legal streams. The majority will go for the fan sub. Why people do this when the legal product is EASIER to obtain is the thing that pisses me off.

I realize I get angry and hot headed when it comes to the topic of fan subs and scanlations but I have very good reason to. I have friends who have been layed off from Viz because of the hard times the company is having thanks to fan subbers and scanlators.(now they are doing everything they can to fight back which I applaud them for) People seem to think they are entitled and that it's SO easy and cheap for the companies to release this stuff quick. The fact is it's not and it's obvious why to anyone who knows a single thing about the business.

Therein lies the key factor. Being that it's a business they are in it to make profit. If people BOUGHT the product instead of downloading it illegally the companies would be releasing faster. Supply and demand would kick it. They would hire more people to release things faster and in turn license more shows. But when so few people are putting money into the system they instead have to work slower and cut jobs and in some cases go out of business permanently(Geneon anyone?)

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 2284d ago
SynGamer2284d ago

"I realize I get angry and hot headed when it comes to the topic of fan subs and scanlations but I have very good reason to. I have friends who have been layed off from Viz because of the hard times the company is having thanks to fan subbers and scanlators.(now they are doing everything they can to fight back which I applaud them for) People seem to think they are entitled and that it's SO easy and cheap for the companies to release this stuff quick. The fact is it's not and it's obvious why to anyone who knows a single thing about the business."

Your friends didn't get laid off because of fansubbers and scanlators, they got laid off because we're in a recession. The global economy is just now starting to recover. VIZ, FUNimation, Tokyopop, they all need to get with the times. People aren't going to pay hard-earned money for the original source as you suggested above if it does them no good. I'll gladly buy something if it's in my language, that's fine, but it's unreasonable to expect me to buy something that isn't. And they aren't going to lose money when I never intended to buy the original source "just to support them". They've been ripping us off for decades, hell, I remember buying anime for $30 and it only had 4 episodes. F-that!

When these companies pull their heads out of their asses and realize we'll pay good money if they treat us fairly, that's when I'll gladly support them. Until then, all I have is fansubs and scanlations. When I hear a series has been licensed, I proudly pre-order the first volume(s).

You make it seem as if I'm stealing money from these companies when in fact I'm not. But just to break down my point further;

Anime X is Japanese only. I'm not going to buy this because I don't know Japanese.

Therefore the company that makes Anime X was NEVER going to see my money anyway.

Now, when said company makes Anime X available in my language, THAT'S when they get my money. They aren't losing (very much) money to fansubs and scans because the media isn't available to us in a form that we can read/watch. It would be like saying "here's a hot dog" even though I'm vegetarian, "buy this now to support us and if/when we make tofu dogs you can but that too." Doesn't make much sense. But at this point we'll agree to disagree.

aaddff2283d ago Show